Logistics forcing change

[GJEC]

Oct 2, 2012 9:04:38 GMT -5 powerof0ne said:

there are a few exceptions, but those exceptions are usually with huge names

There's a very big name over here I know well who charges silly money.

When I saw him and asked him why, I expected him to say "I prefer teaching the successful" or something along those lines. But he smuggly admitted that desperate people are prepared to pay a fortune.

Not impressed. So much for MA teaching ethics, eh?

Gary

[meguro]

Guys, guys. guys. How much is your time and expertise worth? A lot, I'd say. There are financially viable Muay Thai gyms, Yoga studios, studios packed with stationary bike-that's right, just stationary bikes- all over my town. What I see are successful businessmen and women, not shysters. If the students felt that they were being ripped off, they would go somewhere else. Instead, they fill the studios to overflowing.

With traditional karate, the focus seems to be on achieving the black belt, rather than adopting a healthy lifestyle, getting stronger, fitter, more self-confident, etc. With rank as the objective, and using kata as a measure of advancement, the more valuable things are ignored. Customers today can smell the con. De-emphasize rank and provide a means of self-transformation, self-determination, self defense and charge a rate you can live off guilt free.

Finally, like any business, it's all about location.

[GJEC]

Oct 2, 2012 17:38:59 GMT -5 meguro said:

Guys, guys. guys. How much is your time and expertise worth?

I prefer not to ask that question. Last time I asked the seniors how much they thought was fair per session I got a reality check.

The ideal amount would take the issue of fees / bills off the table, but with the numbers we have that would be rather expensive. We are not running at a loss, but huge insurance bills take the fun out of it. Suffice to say TL Risk Solutions earn more from Charnwood Karate than I do.

Gary

[Ros]

Oct 3, 2012 7:52:31 GMT -5 GJEC said:

Last time I asked the seniors how much they thought was fair per session I got a reality check.

Unfortunately, (subconciously or otherwise) I imagine the question that actually got answered was 'Mmm, do I really want to pay any more per session?'

[meguro]

I suppose you could grandfather in the regular students at the current rate. New students get the new rate, or you could come up with a different payment plan: ticket book of classes; advance payment with discount; drop-in rate. You could also offer different classes and maybe capture a new class of students: stretching classes; conditioning/boot camp; self-defense; instructor training class; intro to karate.

[GJEC]

Some good ideas Meguro

I think most long term instructors would agree that the the single most irritating thing with a dojo is setting the fees. Let me give an example in simple terms. A while back people (not all) were moaning about how unfair monthly fees are. They work shifts, their wife works shifts, the dog works shifts etc etc, so we had a pow-wow about it after training and by majority decided that 'pay on the night' works best.

Within a month people were moaning about what a pain in the arse it was having to remember fees ...

Here's the killer though: IT WAS THE SAME PEOPLE

I don't ever think people should train for free, in fact I've often joked that if I won the lotto I'd still charge. (In reality that's nonsense as I'd be in Tuscany driving my Bugatti to a fine restaurant)

But I digress, people should pay for instruction. We tend to value what we pay for and turn up if we have pre-paid for something. But I still get people who think I should teach 'for the love of it' or 'because you enjoy it'.

I do, but I enjoy doing stuff with my family as well. The other night I had three texts from seniors crying off as they had to do things with their children. Meanwhile mine are conditioned not to ask if they can do something on club nights ...

I think most instructors will understand what I'm writing here. We love the training and in many cases are good friends with the people we coach. While we don't want adulation or a fortune a bit of good grace paying reasonable fees for our experience and help should not be too much to ask. Neither should be the commitment to match the time we invest in their improvement, instead of crying off at a moments notice.

Time will tell.

Gary

[curlbroscience]

Salted Gary and Meguro

[powerof0ne]

I was attempting to teach for very cheap, and even FREE for students that supposedly couldn't afford lessons.

Times are sometimes tough, and I'm a reasonable Man, come talk to me, and I'll work something out but I expect to be paid for when that person starts making money, again.

It's the biggest slap in the face when you are teaching a student for free, giving them a uniform, sparring gear and see they have money for other entertainment things, gifts for others, etc.

I agree with Gary 110%, too, people put value on what they pay, more so than they do on what they don't pay for.

As I've said in the past year, if somebody can train in a full contact martial art, compete, try to compete, etc...than they can physically do some sort of a job to make money.

Martial arts are a luxury, not a necessity.
*if you have a family, family comes first
1. Have money to live for shelter, medical/dental care, food, pay bills, etc.
2. Time with your loved ones
3. Paying all your bills first
4. After all this, if you have anything left, pay for your luxuries such as knockdown karate, shooting guns, hunting, fishing, etc.
Osu!

[Ros]

Oct 3, 2012 14:18:14 GMT -5 GJEC said:

... so we had a pow-wow about it after training and by majority decided that 'pay on the night' works best.

I must be getting old, I don't remember that - which is surprising, because I'm sure I would have moaned all the way home if 'pay on the night' won a vote!


I think most exercise type-training that has more than one class per week let you pay monthly or quarterly for unlimited training and then if you want to pay on the night it costs you comparatively more. We paid for a whole year up front once - that was great!

[GJEC]

I'm talking a long while back - although the same gripe was used recently so we tried it again with similar results.

Never again!

There really is no way (with fees) that suits everyone, so my usual response now to parents is "Would you be happier at another club?"

Gary

[hokuto12]

Maybe you need some naked photos of the Dean PO1 and I am sure you might get some more training times.

[powerof0ne]

Part of the problem is that I have to wait on so many people to get anything done. This "break" has made me realize that if I don't get what I asked for than its shut down for good. I won't compromise, my time is just as precious, if not more than my students since I'm the only one that was really commuting there and back. No point in teaching if you have to compromise too much and feel like you no longer have any control as an instructor, especially if you're more or less "non profit" or near.
Osu!

[powerof0ne]

Contacted a few churches and a nearby rec center, will contact another one soon, too..and see what they say. It maybe doable, and may not be, but I won't know, if I don't ask .
Osu!

[powerof0ne]

Received great news, a very reasonable flat monthly rate, that also allows me to teach non-university students! This will mean, I will need to raise tuition, but it will mean, I can get much more students, and I'm willing to bet, a large number of serious ones, that won't be as distracted with school (I urge them to place school first, the uni students, that is).

After my night class I have tonight, I'll go over figures, and come up with a "game plan."
Osu!

[MMX]

That is great news! ;D

Osu!