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Kata
Mar 5, 2012 15:30:22 GMT -5
Post by MMX on Mar 5, 2012 15:30:22 GMT -5
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shugyo
Member
Proof Is On The Floor!!
Posts: 76
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Kata
Jun 24, 2013 1:14:27 GMT -5
Post by shugyo on Jun 24, 2013 1:14:27 GMT -5
I enjoy discovering the unknown that's not been uncovered as of yet, as I chip away and away. I don't enjoy the negativity about kata from karateka's because, imho, kata is quite important to a karateka's betterment; the Three K's!!
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Kata
Jul 7, 2013 15:03:34 GMT -5
Post by powerof0ne on Jul 7, 2013 15:03:34 GMT -5
I've said this a few times, but there was a time I knew and regularly practiced around 50 kata. It was ridiculous, and I feel no shame in saying I forgot many of them but I'm sure I could re-learn many of them in about 5 minutes. I've read articles by Demura Fumio and others saying that many of the kata I learned as a brown belt or shodan, they didn't learn until they were sandan or higher. I believe that karate is being diluted, compared to what it was...too much kata is being freely taught before the other kata is really learned.
My students get mad at me, even though they won't admit it, that I haven't taught them more kata. The reason why is because they don't train it on their own, the kata that I taught them, so I have to re-teach them. This is one of my biggest pet peeves as an instructor. If instructors have to re-teach kata, they shouldn't be teaching more advanced kata. Osu!
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blacktiger
Member
Looking to gain "Acceptance"
Posts: 93
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Kata
Jul 15, 2013 8:24:37 GMT -5
Post by blacktiger on Jul 15, 2013 8:24:37 GMT -5
I enjoy all my Kata, I've reduced my personal Amount from 26 to 13, removing many Traditional forms to the fact that its only Bassai (Dai) and Niseishi (Nijushiho) and the rest are Ashihara Kata or Hybrids of Ashihara Kata.
Bunkai and Ohyo are very important to mer and one thing I noticed about Ashihara Kata was the lack of types of kick, predominantly Round Kicks are the staple kick. In Bunkai and Ohyo I allow the ability to amend the kick for any Kick fitting of the situation.
We have Nage Kata which are actually Nage Kata, Jissen Kata which is more Infighting, Kihon is more Goshin Based and Kumite Kata which is more usable for sparring
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Kata
Jul 15, 2013 10:58:28 GMT -5
Post by MMX on Jul 15, 2013 10:58:28 GMT -5
13 is not bad. Nice job. Less is more sometimes.
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blacktiger
Member
Looking to gain "Acceptance"
Posts: 93
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Kata
Jul 16, 2013 4:48:00 GMT -5
Post by blacktiger on Jul 16, 2013 4:48:00 GMT -5
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GJEC
Member
LOUGHBOROUGH ENSHIN
Posts: 3,218
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Post by GJEC on Jul 16, 2013 5:57:37 GMT -5
Enshin has 6 kata, one for each belt. As I start to get moving again I've found the practise of them in my garden, smoothly - almost aikido like - has been strangely therapeutic.
Gary
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Kata
Jul 16, 2013 11:11:39 GMT -5
Post by MMX on Jul 16, 2013 11:11:39 GMT -5
Kancho Ninomiya did study some Aikido as well as his Judo background.
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GJEC
Member
LOUGHBOROUGH ENSHIN
Posts: 3,218
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Kata
Jul 16, 2013 11:38:14 GMT -5
Post by GJEC on Jul 16, 2013 11:38:14 GMT -5
Likewise.
As a young man I could never understand the appeal of flowing movements, I just wanted to hit things (and people) as hard as I could.
I do now though. A few Enshin kata make me feel good.
Gary
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blacktiger
Member
Looking to gain "Acceptance"
Posts: 93
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Kata
Jul 17, 2013 4:13:34 GMT -5
Post by blacktiger on Jul 17, 2013 4:13:34 GMT -5
I practice 2 Traditional Kata, Bassai and Niseishi, just for the relaxation it gives, I also practice it open handed not closed fist like Japanese Karate
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Kata
Jul 18, 2013 11:06:46 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by ryosakazaki on Jul 18, 2013 11:06:46 GMT -5
After seeing Ashihara's 18 kata and now hearing about how Enshin only has 6-7 kata, I feel like I've been wasting all those time learning useless kata...I'd rather learn the 6 basic positions of BJJ, variants, transitions, sweeps, locks, chokes,etc., judo/wrestling, etc. face punches to make karate a more well-rounded system than learn kata that have little to no combative value (aside from getting promoted to the next kyu or dan...). There're good reasons why there are off-shoots that deal with little to no kata.
Of course, some might say then I'd better do MMA instead of karate.
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blacktiger
Member
Looking to gain "Acceptance"
Posts: 93
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Kata
Jul 18, 2013 11:19:58 GMT -5
Post by blacktiger on Jul 18, 2013 11:19:58 GMT -5
After seeing Ashihara's 18 kata and now hearing about how Enshin only has 6-7 kata, I feel like I've been wasting all those time learning useless kata...I'd rather learn the 6 basic positions of BJJ, variants, transitions, sweeps, locks, chokes,etc., judo/wrestling, etc. face punches to make karate a more well-rounded system than learn kata that have little to no combative value (aside from getting promoted to the next kyu or dan...). There're good reasons why there are off-shoots that deal with little to no kata. Of course, some might say then I'd better do MMA instead of karate. No Kata is useless!!!! Its how you work with the Kata you have. If you want kata just for passing grades then that's up to you, but for me I've taken Shoshin No Kata Sono Ichi and used the standard Application Then I went for a Stand-up Grapping application of the same kata Then I went to Ground work of the same Kata, working all the techniques from my back With respect if you say kata is useless you've missed the whole point of the kata in the first place. I've used Ashihara Kata in Live situations out on the street not just in the dojo Ashihara IS a complete style just needs the right Sensei to show you OSU
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GJEC
Member
LOUGHBOROUGH ENSHIN
Posts: 3,218
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Kata
Jul 18, 2013 11:47:16 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by GJEC on Jul 18, 2013 11:47:16 GMT -5
I'm always wary of 'complete' claims as it usually comes with 'applications' for every possible scenario. Put simply, reaching a stage of instinctive competency in any skill is a lot of work, in hundreds of skills it's just a dream.
IMO People are most dangerous with a few good skills they have drilled to perfection, coupled with a TNS mindset.
Just my 2p
Gary
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Kata
Jul 18, 2013 12:39:15 GMT -5
Post by meguro on Jul 18, 2013 12:39:15 GMT -5
For several months now I have been learning and drilling applications: basically counters to a lead hand punch. The opponent throws a punch, I respond with from one of four entries, and then apply one technique from out of 5. This arrangement yields many possible combinations which include standing chokes, arm bars, takedowns. This is all at the entry level of the Silat I have been studying since moving. What I like about this system of Martial Arts is that there is no mystery about what one gesture might signify as in kata. Learn the applications first, then learn the mnemonic to help you retain the information. I cannot think of a more logical way to go about it.
For karateka, many of the movements in Silat are quite similar to those found in kata and kihon. The beauty is that now there is meaning attached.
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blacktiger
Member
Looking to gain "Acceptance"
Posts: 93
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Kata
Jul 19, 2013 3:54:01 GMT -5
Post by blacktiger on Jul 19, 2013 3:54:01 GMT -5
I'm always wary of 'complete' claims as it usually comes with 'applications' for every possible scenario. Put simply, reaching a stage of instinctive competency in any skill is a lot of work, in hundreds of skills it's just a dream. IMO People are most dangerous with a few good skills they have drilled to perfection, coupled with a TNS mindset. Just my 2p Gary Hi Gary, you have a point, maybe "Complete" isn't the best word for it, maybe "Allrounded" is a bit more relevant. We have Styles banded into different catergories; Internal, External, Striking, Grappling & Weapons so I suppose if it "ticks" all the boxes then it could be concidered as complete, but every art has its weaknesses and even its best fighters have various obsticles to get over. Mushashi (Book of 5 Rings) even said one must look at other schools to find weaknesses in your own. I try to add many components to my style so it can be used in situations that could occur. Famous arts concidered as complete are Jeet Kune Do and Hapkido but not seen much of their syllabus. I don't teach 3 dozen wrist grips or 2 dozen leg locks/arm locks etc, or the complete throwing list of the Kodokan Judoka but its enough to cover all the bases.
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